I think Tyreek is a piece of shit, but these officers didn’t handle this very well either.
The window being all the way down was not a safety issue, but i have zero faith that a court would determine the cops to have used excessive force. I’ll see you all at the next post where nothing changes!
when everyone and their mother has a gun in the U.S., and you’re hiding behind heavily tinted windows, then yes, it is a safety issue. It’s not an unreasonable request to keep your window rolled down during a traffic stop.
Don’t take the job if you ain’t willing to take a bullet over a traffic stop. That’s the job. You don’t get to violate rights for your own safety. Your safety is secondary as a cop. If you can’t handle that fact of the position then you would be a shit cop.
Pizza delivery drivers have a higher chance to get shot than a fucking cop and yet you don’t hear pizza drivers capping people left and right for their own safety. So I don’t wanna hear your bullshit.
Die for that traffic stop pig. You wanted the badge without the risk.
As we saw, it’s actually a bigger safety issue if the cops can order you to lower your window. Fortunately, you and I don’t get to decide what’s “reasonable” in this context. It would go to the appeals courts, and who knows what would happen.
I think it’s likely that the appeals courts would say that Pennsylvania v. Mimms already let cops order people out of the car, which solves the safety problem, so there’s no need to give cops extra authority to order you around willy-nilly. The ordinary person has a clear interest in knowing what exactly cops can and can’t order, and you’re proposing increasing the ambiguity of it all, which (as we just saw) is dangerous.
it’s actually a bigger safety issue if the cops can order you to lower your window
most inane take I’ve read about this interaction
You didn’t explain, which suggests shadiness, but let’s assume better… Let’s assume you didn’t understand what I meant.
Cops can let you stay in the car. They can make you get out, if they have solid grounds to do so. That’s relatively simple, and it lets cops choose the best location for the interaction. So it’s safe for the cops (but not the occupants). Whatever, that’s the law, OK.
But they can’t have it both ways. If they let you stay in the car, they’ve already decided you probably aren’t going to grab a gun from under the seat. So there’s no safety issue for them.
But there is for you. They might reach in the window, for example, violating your civil rights. It would be better for them to have to open the door. It’s easy to see big actions on dash and body cameras, and it’s harder to write them off as accidental. You could even keep your door locked. After all, who knows if the cops stopping you are upstanding citizens. Who will vouch for their character, my friend?
Lock the door, crack the window as necessary, get out when ordered, always film the pigs. This is 100% legal common sense. Or don’t, and risk your own safety. It’s your life.
But they can’t have it both ways.
Per famous case law, finders v keepers.
wild logic.
If they let you stay in the car, they’ve already decided you probably aren’t going to grab a gun from under the seat. So there’s no safety issue for them.
Dude, you aren’t making a lick of sense. Google “officer shot during traffic stop” and tell me again that keeping your window rolled down during a traffic stop is unreasonable.
crack the window as necessary, get out when ordered
two things he refused to do? What are you talking about, dude?
Did you watch the video? Your facts don’t quite match what it showed. He gave the cops his papers, and then he closed the window, because he didn’t need it open until they got back with his ticket. That’s when they started power tripping. If they wanted him out of the car, all they had to do was wait 10 or 20 seconds. It really was that simple. But they wanted violence, so that’s what they created.
What’s actually dangerous to cops? The number one thing is bad driving by the cops themselves, which is the leading cause of death for officers on duty. During the pandemic, the pandemic itself was the other leading cause I think, because many officers didn’t believe in it and they put themselves at risk.
Every year US cops shoot and kill over a thousand people. Many of those people are innocent. The risk to the average citizen is high, but the risk to the cop is much much lower. The last numbers I saw were in the hundreds, in the low hundreds, but it might even be lower than that. And now you’re trying to carve out a special situation, where the cop is not shot when they first approached the car, but is only later shot after they already got the papers from the driver, and specifically because the driver closed their tinted window. I wonder if you can find even a single example of that happening in the last year. This is an issue that I tend to pay attention to, and I can’t think of it happening in recent history.
And you might want to argue that we should err on the side of caution. First of all, that’s not the law of the land. The Constitution doesn’t allow you to do that. Second, if the situation is as rare as I think it is, almost or entirely non-existent, then what you’re talking about is paranoia. In that case, you need a psychologist, not an open window. Third, the threat to the driver and passengers is real. If the cop makes a mistake, they may draw their gun and shoot people in the car. What if an acorn falls near them? They might shoot the driver. Sadly, this is a very real situation, unlike your hypothetical. In other words, the facts are not on your side here.
I’ll get downvoted, but the body cam footage I saw showed Tyreek talking back to the officer, refusing instructions by rolling up his window, and telling them not to knock on his car window. It’s not exactly surprising he got yanked out of his car. Go ahead and argue it wouldn’t happen to a white person. I’m not getting into that discussion. Perhaps the cops should have attempted to deescalate, but Tyreek did himself 0 favors. Was not surprised that he found out after fucking around with the cop.
I’ve been Tyreek and have been picked up on disorderly conduct charges for mocking a police officer to his face. They did not treat me like that. It was all bullshit too, they just wanted to search me thinking I was an easy target.
What you’re are saying is the police get your complete obedience no matter what. Frankly, that is just not how humans work. I don’t care if you’re an authority. If you target me I will feel a way about it.
Edit: BTW charges dropped because being rude is not illegal. Cops don’t just get your complete obedience. That is not the law. It may be a norm but we have the power to change norms. To change laws. Don’t perpetuate your own oppression.
My dad once rolled his window up on a cop. He told officer to wait because he was on a cell call with my step mom.
He didn’t get dragged out of vehicle, the state tropper waited and then gave my dad a huge fine.
Two things this was the 90’s in Texas and my dad is white.
Being rude is protected by the Constitution, as you learned in high school civics class. You did a perfect job of blaming the victim.
On the other hand, maybe what you were trying to say is something like, “We gotta be practically-minded because the cops are dirty racist bastards who will beat the hell out of us.”
Yeah man, being rude to a public servant justifies being torn out of your car, slammed into the pavement and placed in handcuffs. Fuck right off.
Disrespecting a police officer is not an invitation for police brutality. You are a bootlicker for having this mentality.
Police officers should be professionals and try to use the least violent means necessary, and if there is even a hint of excess, they should be deemed unfit to hold the power of authority over others. Police should be reactive on the escalation ladder, only using violence when they receive violence. However, police are given a carte blanche to do violence by claiming in any interaction that they felt threatened, giving them impunity and why we’re here today.
Okay, I will argue that. Because it wouldn’t have happened to a white person. I’ve seen white people get away with doing a lot more than that to cops.
On occasion, racist cops will violate white folks too. They’re never perfectly racist.
At this point, what you’re saying is like telling a woman she shouldn’t have been there or wearing that, and ignoring the real issue with power here.
Cops largely are pathetic power-abusing shitheads who escalate at every possible opportunity. You should not have to cower to every whim and demand of a cop if you are not doing anything dangerous. Cops have lost any credibility to suggest that we should have to give a shit about every stupid fucking tiny thing they have an issue with.
Based on your argument, you could say you’ll only speak to a lawyer and you’re giving the cops an out to beat the shit out of you for not complying. Cops don’t understand non-violent approaches to solving any problem, and THAT is the problem to focus on.
Fuck the police.
Sure, fuck the police but I argue a white person or a black person is heading for a bad time if they act the way that he acted. I can’t speculate on this any more than anybody else on “what if” scenarios should Tyreek have been white, but if you create a situation where the cop does not feel safe (e.g. rolling up your 100% tinted windows against their instructions) then you are going to get an escalation from the police.
I don’t have any studies to hand, but isn’t the disparity between police responses to non-white vs white suspects a given at this point, in the US at least?
But lets look at your argument both ways.
On the one hand you’d be arguing that race disparity in police responses doesn’t exist at all and so wouldn’t apply here.
Or
Race disparity exists, but in this specific situation it doesn’t apply for some reason.
If that’s the case , id be interested in hearing why you think it doesn’t apply in this specific circumstance?
Neither of those sound plausible to me but i could be missing what your actual argument is entirely, in which case, would you mind explaining why it doesn’t fall in to the above categories?
It’s more the latter. I don’t argue that race disparity exists. I’m only arguing that Tyreek did not do any kind of favor to himself in how he handled the situation. I’m sorry he got pulled from his car and cuffed, but my reaction to the video was that he had this coming. Blatantly disobeying an officer’s requests and in a way that can lead the officer to feel unsure over his/her safety and perceived control of the situation is going to end poorly. This could easily happen to a white person.
There are videos of white people doing this kind of thing and getting manhandled. Usually Karens.
