I’ve long been annoyed that everyone, including myself uses Paypal/ Venmo for moving money around. What alternatives do you find useful? Here’s a list (https://alternativeto.net/software/venmo/). GNU Taler looks viable (https://taler.net/en/index.html). I would love to have your thoughts!
XMR / Monero - open source, fungible, private digital cash
It usually can’t be used with retailors, but you can send your friend circle lunch money and the like easily. https://www.getmonero.org/
If the retailer supports bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies, you can pay with Monero using an exchange with a flat rate such as https://exch.cx or another provider listed on Kyc not me.
Money transfer platforms are even worse than chat apps in terms of how acceptance dictates usefulness. You might convince a couple of friends to use xmpp instead of whatsapp. But its near impossible to get major outlets to integrate new payment methods. Especially if that platform advocates privacy and therefore doesn’t offer a return on invest based on user data. I don’t think we’re gonna see true alternatives without government regulation, and even then…
So true - and I hate having to use specific ones for specific people. Apple Cash works well within my family, I use Venmo for my teen’s drivers Ed, and Zelle for house cleaner
I like GNU Taler because it’s privacy preserving for the customer, is Free, Open Source, and is self hosted. And also because it’s not a new/ different currency.
@Atelopus-zeteki How does it work?
Hellifiknow. I’m just some frog on the intarwebs who wants to learn. :-) Can someone elaborate on GNU Taler?
GNU Taler looks interesting, but is it usable today?
It’s apparently designed around exchanges, and I don’t see any exchanges mentioned on the site. Do any actually exist?
The FAQ mentions depending on wire transfers, which have famously high fees that would have to be passed on to users somehow. Aggregating payments into delayed settlement transfers could mitigate that cost between high-volume organizations, but it won’t help people who just need send money to each other. (Meanwhile, ACH transfers are practically free, but I don’t know if they fit Taler’s design or plans.) Does Taler have a plan to solve this?
I don’t quite understand how it works yet, so wonder: would it work in sanctioned locations, like how, say, Monero can?
Taler is not ment to be completely censorship resistant. It takes the side of dealing with goverment, law and other things and is expected to be used in areas with working democracy.
A private alternative to MasterCard, PayPal, Stripe, etc. not a new currency or completely different banking system. And we need it.
No, but it has potential to become the new digital euro in Europe. I hope it does.
GNU Taler would be the future privacy-focused alternative if you live in europe. Only if EU sees the potential it has and decides to use it for the upcoming digital euro, that is. For now, you can either use cash irl and monero online. The privacy GNU Taler provides in an online state is between normal card payments and cash, while offline usage is close to cash.
Digital euro: https://www.ecb.europa.eu/euro/digital_euro/html/index.en.html
GNU Taler: https://taler.net/en/
Zelle
I’ve seen Zelle recommended. And as it turns out my bank uses it, as well. From Alternativeto:
License Model: Free, Proprietary Platforms; Android, iPhone
Zelle® has partnered with leading banks and credit unions across the U.S. to bring you a fast, safe and easy way to send money to friends and family. Money moves quickly - directly from bank account to bank account.
I would never use Zelle:
- https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/06/business/payments-fraud-zelle-banks.html
- https://abc7.com/bank-of-america-zelle-scam-refunds-wire-transfer-bofa/11129385/
- https://www.avanan.com/blog/zelle-phishing
I knew a few not-so-smart people with BoA accounts that got funds drained because phished.
Some sim hyjacking specifically to drain Zelle accounts:
Sure it’s in the past…but I personally leave Zelle functionality from my Bank turned off.
Partenered with? It’s owned by BOA, US Bank, Wells Fargo and JP Morgan Chase. Might be used by smaller folks too but was started by those goons to try to capture mobile and p2p needs and is proprietary and doubtless whores your data. Stay away.
The answer to that is obviously going to be Monero.
Related: I think FedNow (USA) might enable transfers between individuals once the tools and user-facing services are developed. It’s very new.
It’s worth noting that any way to electronically move money is unlikely to stay both private and convenient for long after getting popular, because governments generally don’t like that.
FedNow looks very interesting.
BTC lightning.
Why are you annoyed by Paypal and Venmo? What do you want changed? KYC and these companies having control of your money is common on all these everyday platforms. If you want a real change you need to use self custodial non-KYC crypto currencies.
I’m annoyed by Paypal, Venmo (and other similar vehicles) because they use what should be a simple process (one person giving money to another person) to invade our privacy and to siphon value towards billionaires. I’d rather be able to transfer funds with the simplicity and precision of giving the person standing before me a ‘fiver’. And without someone else making bank off the transaction, for clarity’s sake.
KYC defined: “The Know Your Client (KYC) or Know Your Customer (KYC) is a process to verify the identity and other credentials of a financial services user. KYC is a regulatory process of ascertaining the identity and other information of a financial services user.” https://corporatefinanceinstitute.com/resources/wealth-management/know-your-client-kyc/
