I have a set of 3 Bra Premiere non-stick frying pans that I’ve used for a while. The coating on them says “Teflon Innovations without PFOA”. Recently I’ve noticed that on the most used pan, the 26cm one, the Teflon coating has started to peel off.
I know that Teflon coatings can release harmful fumes and chemicals if overheated, but what about if the coating is physically peeling? Is it still safe to cook with them? Or should I stop using especially the 26cm one? I don’t want to keep exposing my family to anything dangerous unknowingly. Any advice if these types of pans are still safe to cook with if the nonstick surface is peeling would be appreciated!
First of all, if you’re going to buy a fancy expensive non-stick pan, spend the money and buy non-metal utensils to use with it.
Second, if you want to keep using metal utensils, buy anodized aluminum. It’s not perfectly non-stick, but it’s close and it can take a beating.
We got a set of stainless pots and pans last year and as long as you heat the pan before you put food in it, I’ve had less sticking than in my old non stick pans.
Anodized aluminum is porous, that’s how the dye stays attached. Also aluminum is not recommended for use with acidic foods. I would personally avoid it.
Aluminum is porous. Hard anodized aluminum is not. That’s the whole point of anodizing the aluminum, so that it creates a barrier that stops it from reacting with acids.
The barrier to acids comes from oxidizing the surface, which anodizing does. But pores do not exist in bare aluminum, and hard anodize actually has the biggest pores! There is technically a sealer on the surface, but sticking it in hot water can sometimes release it, depending on what sealer was used. Here’s an article with more info: https://www.lightmetalage.com/news/industry-news/surface-finishing/introduction-to-anodizing-aluminum/
That’s for general anodizing, not hard anodizing for cookware. They aren’t going to use the same process for a chair that will never see water versus a pan designed to be immersed in water. Anodized cookware is fine to use with acids.
Can you give me an example? Calphalon for instance have “hard-anodized nonstick” but they’re still teflon. Anodizing is actually how teflon is usually made - the anodizing makes a porous surface that the teflon can stick to. So you’right that the sealer is different, it’s just teflon.
https://madeincookware.com/blogs/non-stick-vs-hard-anodized
Hard anodized aluminum is not teflon.
Nope. It’s exactly the same process - it’s just Type III not type II.
The sealer is what makes it non porous. That sealer is usually teflon that wears off.
It’s exactly the same process - it’s just Type III not type II.
It’s the exact same process, except that it isn’t. Hard anodized aluminum is not teflon.
Hard anodized aluminum is sealed with something, often teflon.
First of all, if you’re going to buy a fancy expensive non-stick pan,
spend the money and buy non-metal utensils to use with it.don’t.FTFY. Expensive non-stick has no practical benefit over cheap non-stick. They all wear out in the same amount of time regardless of price, so you might as well buy the cheap stuff so you don’t feel as bad when it’s time to throw it out.
Otherwise, I’d prefer tri-ply stainless clad aluminum to anodized.
In the pan itself sure, but there’s a lot of difference in the handle & weight between cheap and fancy though. All of my cheap ass nonsticks have had the plastic handles fall off before they start peeling
Hmm… maybe go for something on the cheaper end of the scale but not the absolute cheapest, then. Stuff from T-fal/Tefal (which is the company that invented nonstick cookware, by the way) has been cheap but decent in my experience.
I have parrots so no telfon anything in my house. Bought two Green Pan ceramic skillets fairly cheap and they are still going strong a decade later. Definitely don’t use metal utensils in them.
What does parrots have to do with cookware?
Birds are extremely sensitive to the fumes given off by Teflon and will die. So no Teflon anything in the house.
Holy shit. Had no idea.
deleted by creator
Do you want to eat teflon? 'Cause that’s how you end up eating teflon.
In theory, the teflon should continue to be inert as it passes through your digestive tract, but don’t do that. It’s time to throw out the pan.
Related advice: non-stick is overrated to begin with. Replace all your nonstick pans with tri-ply stainless clad aluminum, cast iron (enameled or not), carbon steel, etc…
If you insist on having a teflon pan, recognize it for the semi-disposable item it is: get the cheapest one you can find, use it only for things that really need it (e.g. eggs), and accept that you’re going to be throwing it out and replacing it every couple of years.
I don’t even think you need one for eggs necessarily. I switched from PTFE nonstick to all metal (stainless/carbon steel and cast iron) a few years back. Eggs were no problem once I figured out heat control. I cook scrambled eggs and omelettes every week with no sticking.
I did eventually get a ceramic nonstick for making soft tofu in a sticky sauce. Definitely don’t try that in a stainless steel pan. It worked okay in the carbon steel wok, but was obnoxious to clean.
I don’t even think you need one for eggs necessarily.
Oh, for sure, you don’t! I didn’t phrase my previous comment correctly: what I meant to convey is that if you must have a teflon pan, only use it for the very few special things that benefit from it the most instead of as a general-purpose pan.
non-stick is overrated to begin with
I’d say it’s correctly rated. It does the no-stick well while not being as durable. In my experience that’s what people expect from it.
I’ve never known anyone in real life who owns Teflon cookware who thinks it’s a concern in any way. If they saw any issue with their 15 year old teflon skillet, it’s that it visually looks bad from all the scratches
That’s because most people didn’t realize they start shedding microplastics after the coating is damaged and you keep cooking with it until pretty recently.
The main issue from Teflon is the manufacture of Teflon
Making that stuff makes some gnarly byproducts
The Teflon it’s is relatively safe as long as you keep it under like 220C, if it gets too hot it will start breaking down and releasing some gnarly gas
I mean, I never cared to know more, when in 2001 someone told me that I’d be eating chemicals if I used metal utensils with non stick. I never needed or wanted proof that was bad. Other than having to explain this several times, it’s never caused me any issue just to not do it. Using different cookware or a wooden spoon is quite a low effort fix.
I’ve found that time and again, when I explain this, people almost act like I’m stupid for caring to take this tiny precaution. I’ve always found it really weird to need hard evidence before taking easy precautions which cost little to nothing… Like people who smoked until it was proven to cause cancer. It was pretty fucking obvious to anyone couple years into adulthood and paying attention… that shit was bad for you.
The one concern is that cheaper ones get ruined real fast, that’s why all cooking groups hate them (but people also keep buying them because cheap and convenient).
No stick but not durable seems to be the consensus I’ve seen and that’s, yeah that’s what it is.
The one concern is that cheaper ones get ruined real fast
Expensive ones get ruined real fast, too. There’s no point in buying expensive teflon cookware; it all wears out at the same rate, so the fancy stuff is just a rip-off.
Oh. I’ve had much better experience with more expensive ones. At least in my use they seem to survive better.
I don’t have personal experience with it myself; all I know is that experts (e.g. America’s Test Kitchen, who test pans regularly, and Alton Brown, who wrote a book on what pans to own) tend to recommend cheaper pans.
Hard to argue with that. Maybe I’ve just been lucky
I learned that the biggest difference between cheap and expensive non stick pans is basically the amount of non stick coatings. Regardless, the non stick coating will wear off over time. This was the conclusion from a documentary I once watched on whether it was more economical to bit a cheap pan every so often or an expensive pan less often.
Personally I would strongly recommend cast iron from a reputable brand or carbon steel if you can afford it. Stainless steel also works, but is more tricky to not stick. Cast iron is heavier, but very forgiving and will last you a generation or more.
The non-sticks are usually cheap and require minimal effort. Carbon steel could be a cool alternative though
There is an episode of the Dave Chang show podcast that covers this. They have a professor on to cover the science of different pans. If I remember correctly, it should be safe as it will through your digestive system. The bigger issue is overheating Teflon. That being said, you still don’t really want non food in your food, and that pan is likely pretty worthless from a non-stick perspective
I’ve looked into this when buying pans, I’d say it’s still unsafe. Apparently in 2013 they changed their formulation so the chemicals aren’t toxic and if ingested it’s inert so it doesn’t affect you at all.
With all that, I still don’t trust non-stick and bought myself a stainless steel pan and I love it. It’s easy to maintain and when cooking properly most things don’t really stick either.
Would you have resources or advice about cooking properly on a stainless steel pan ?
Preheat and use a decent amount of oil
Preheat the empty pan. You’ll know it’s hot enough when you throw water droplets on and it beads and dances around. Depending on the pan and situation, they’re pretty sensitive to heat so youd mainly cook on a low or medium.
Then use a good amount of oil and/or butter. I’ve even cooked eggs without much hassle.
You often need less heat than you think. Use oil. Pretty much everything should cook better in a stainless with a little bit of learning curve, except eggs.* Yes, even fish. Keep steel wool and barkeeper’s friend handy for scrubbing them back to a shiny polish.
*Cook eggs in a non stick that you use for basically nothing but eggs.
Also try not to load it with a lot of food. I sometimes need to, and when I do, it seems to cool the pan a bit and the food starts to stick. I normally just raise the heat a bit.
What did you do to the poor thing? Looks like you’ve been stabbing it with a fork 24/7 for years. Toss it, and be (a lot) more careful with the next one - or skip nonstick entirely. They already have a finite lifetime when not abused, and if you manage to ruin the coat in one spot that’s a hotspot for “scaling off” more.
Stainless steel can take a beating, though, go nuts.
Cast iron is non-stick and so much easier to clean
Cast iron is nice, I recommended stainless because I assume someone who treats pans like this would ruin cast iron too.
Cast iron is nearly impossible to “ruin”, the idea that you can is nothing more than a huge circlejerk. Even a completely rust covered cast iron pan can likely be made basically good as new with a little effort.
Obviously restoring your pan every time you wanna use it isn’t practical, so you still wanna take care of it, but actually permanently ruining it? Good luck.
I wasn’t really referring to permanently mangling the iron. Taking care of seasoning is an extra thing, is all, and the seasoning can absolutely be ruined.
It depends. I ruined my Teflon, but my cast iron is great. Mostly I just hate plastic spatulas.
Unless of course you want to use a dishwasher. Even manually it really isn’t ‘so much easier to clean’ and you have to spend time seasoning it.
Once you season cast iron you can clean it however you want. Even with soap. The oils you bake on there at such high heat causes polymerization.
You don’t have to continue to season cast iron after cleaning it, unless you’re cleaning it with a fucking angle grinder.
Putting a seasoned cast iron pan in the dishwasher isn’t a great idea, in my experience
Dishwashers can have some pretty high pressures involved, I wouldn’t be surprised if it can literally chip the seasoning off.
I might be wrong, but I think if your “seasoning” is thick enough to chip off it means you did it wrong and failed to scrub away the excess food residue.
Afaik you can’t put the non stick in the dishwasher either?
Been doing it for years with no apparent ill effects
I don’t see why not? They won’t rust in there like cast iron would
Not about rust, but the chemicals in the detergent can harm the coating iirc.
I have a cast iron pan that I’ve used for almost 10 years. I seasoned it when I got it. To clean it, I scrub it with steel wool, dry it off then rub a coat of oil on it. It still looks and works perfectly. Cast iron is extremely easy to clean and upkeep.
Yeh,
Scrubbing it with steel wool, drying it and then rubbing in oil doesn’t sound as easy as ‘put in dishwasher’. I couldn’t be doing with that, cooking for a family every day
I cook for a family of four every day and taking 3 minutes to clean my cast iron pan is the least time consuming part of it. You’re being dramatic.
I’m not being dramatic- I just don’t see much benefit from the faff. And I’ve never actually found a well-seasoned cast iron pan that is as non-stick as a non-stick.
… hence the need for the wire wool, I guess.
Oh, my point wasn’t that a cast iron pan is as non-stick as Teflon. I was simply talking about cast iron upkeep. I have a non stick pan and it’s much better for certain things for sure. But I wash it by hand instead of putting it in the dishwasher.
I don’t have any zods but i got some chipped rubies
“Safe” is a relative term. Is it going to set your house on fire? No. Is it going to release harmful gasses while you cook and leech toxic metals into your food and slowly poison you? Yeah, probably. But, like, how old are you? Maybe you’re like 98 years old and don’t have that much longer to live anyway.
Fuck’s smatterchew? Throw that shit out and get a new pan. Damn.
I think generally it’s considered safe apart from the gases, but that’s an issue if you heat it to a much too high of a temperature. And it seems like they make you feel sick but it passes in few hours.
I have never heard anyone manage to get that though. Maybe if you forget the pan on the stove, but then you wouldn’t be standing there breathing the fumes? I dunno
I got tired of seeing my teflon-coated pans wear out like that or lose their non-stickiness, it bothered me to realize that the ‘premium cookware’ I was buying was temporary trash I’d need to replace every couple of years.
I retired my teflon cookware and now have just steel and cast iron (and ceramic-coated cast iron) and I don’t miss teflon-coated cookware at all.
Sure, sometimes I end up with stuff stuck to my pans, but realistically that was true with my ‘non-stick’ pans as well. The nice thing about cast iron and steel is that with use, they seem to get better, whereas the teflon pans start out nice but deteriorate in the way they work. When I do end up with stuff stuck to the pan, I can scrub that clean in a few seconds with a steel scrubber or scraper, whereas stuck-on stuff with teflon (the stuff the dishwasher didn’t get, anyhow), seemed to demand the extra-soft scrubber (and lots of time, because the soft scrubber doesn’t work as well).
-
Don’t heat a non-stick on high, like ever. Medium is as high as they can take.
-
Use silicon utensils.
We had issues until we stopped doing #1. The cheap non-stick Tfals we have now have lasted 10+ years. The old expensive ones didn’t make it past the first few.
*silicone. You wouldn’t want silicon utensils.
lol. Fair correction.
-
I stopped using non stick pots/pans completely. PFOS or whatever other fucked up, deadly, untested chemicals can get out of my life forever. We may think they’re safe but do we really know? “They” told us the original teflon was safe and look at how that turned out.
I now have an induction range and only use cast iron and stainless steel. Yes, I sometimes have to scrub or soak my pans but I believe me and mine will live longer and healthier.
Cast iron does make better tasting food, IMHO. Takes some getting used to and more work to clean but I think it’s worth it.
Getting rid of Teflon around here too.
I like the process of maintaining cast-iron pans. And they get better theore I use them. Definately better than the constant deterioration of the Teflon ones.
Enamel coated steel is ok. Just steel is ok too.
But I really like the cast iron ones.
I have bare and enameled cast iron and bare stainless steel. I have not heard of enamel coated steel. I need to research that.
It’s not very durable, I don’t recommend it. Inherited it. Fine a a freebee, but I wouldn’t spend money. And if it starts to chip just toss it out.
Pretty sure I do have enamel coated steel for my camp set of dishes. Interesting.
“They” is frequently used as an antisemitic dog whistle fyi
There is literally nothing in the post indicating any religion. I interpreted “they” in this case as industry leaders/the FDA
This is correct, thanks.
No idea how someone could think I was being antisemitic from that post yet here we are.
Man, it’s the “ok signs are nazi dog whistles” shit all over. You aren’t, they’re being knee-jerk over reactive.
I didn’t think you were being antisemitic, i assumed you were unaware of the way that antisemites use the word
Wat
My guy, “they” is just a pronoun. Not everything can be a dog whistle.
Its specifically when applying emphasis, usually with ((())), but not always. Using the word they on its own is not an issue, but in cases like this its usually better to say who you mean, instead of letting people assume.
Or we can not give quite so much power to single word dog whistles, particularly in cases when there’s no actual anti-Semitic content within the post. It’s like the fuckin OK sign all over.
I think it’s better to take in the whole context, and then you don’t have to assume anything.
Fuck off Israel propoganda bot.
Beep boop you got me
No, it’s toxic. Replace it with carbon steel, stainless steel, or cast iron.
why does it look like a very old whale who’s battled hundreds of squids? Ever hear of wood or silicone utensils?
- Chunks of teflon are getting in your food
- The aluminium underneath, which was protected by the teflon, is getting into your food (especially true with acidic foods, since they will react with aluminium and erode it).
I don’t know that the PTFE is going to be any worse than all the other micro plastic we’re eating*, but the aluminum definitely is a problem.
Id suggest replacing it (or using the others until you can replace it,)
Tomorrow might be a good time if you can afford it, with all the sales.
*ain’t life grand?
There was that town in the US where 3M dumped PTFE into the rivers and it made it into the drinking water, I watched a documentary where people in that town have a cancer rate 169 times the national average. IIRC
PTFE is one of the greatest chemicals to ingest… if you want to grow some extra body parts.
I think you might be thinking about this
Perfluorooctanoic acid (PFOA), a chemical formerly used in the manufacture of PTFE products such as non-stick coated cookware, can be carcinogenic for people who are exposed to it (see Ecotoxicity).[66] Concerning levels of PFOA have been found in the blood of people who work in or live near factories where the chemical is used, and in people regularly exposed to PFOA-containing products such as some ski waxes and stain-resistant fabric coatings, but non-stick cookware was not found to be a major source of exposure, as the PFOA is burned off during the manufacturing process and not present in the finished product.[64] Non-stick coated cookware has not been manufactured using PFOA since 2013,[67] and PFOA is no longer being made in the United States.[66]
Shouldn’t be used anymore
PTFE is one of the greatest chemicals to ingest… if you want to grow some extra body parts.
Actually ingesting teflon “chips” (hah) shouldn’t do anything. It should just pass through without interacting with your body. Not a pleasant thought, eating them, but shouldn’t have any harmful effects either.
That’s the stuff, serves me right for only half paying attention to a documentary. Either way I’ll probably steer clear of Teflon pans in future.
I did try to find ScotchGuard a few years ago when I got a new Sofa (Couch for the Americans) and I found it was discontinued because it was probably just PFOA in a spray bottle :)
No, it’s not safe to keep using nonstick pans that are peeling, but people still use them anyway.
I think it’s safe in that the coating won’t poison you. They should just pass through without harming you. But it’s not a very pleasant idea, so I would get a new pan just for that.
There’s a couple misconceptions in this thread.
Yes, Teflon can release some gasses if overheated, but it’s not likely going to cause you any real harm. As long as you’re turning on the range hood while you cook, it’s basically a non-issue. Teflon really only releases fumes at very high temperatures (usually over 500F), and foods that are being cooked at that high heat aren’t really going to be needing a non-stick coating to begin with, so you’d ideally want to use a different type of pan for foods cooked at very high heat in the first place.
If you really huff the fumes intentionally, you might give yourself a headache/fever (look up “Teflon flu” for more), but it’s not likely gonna kill you. However, some pets may be more susceptible to Teflon fumes, particularly birds, who can very easily die from Teflon fumes, so be cautious if you have any animals in your home.
As for the aluminum underneath, that’s also largely a non-issue. Aluminum is safe to cook with in most applications. It’s even relatively safe to consume, and it’s actually used in many common medicines (like aspirin and antacids) and also as a food additive in some cases. There’s a reason why acidic foods like tomatoes and pineapples are canned in aluminum; because it’s safe to do so. If a little aluminum from the can/pan leeches out into the food, it’s not a big deal as it’ll pass through you unnoticed. It’s only really a concern if you already have issues with high amounts of metal consumption in your diet. Some people believe that aluminum can cause or accelerate certain conditions like Alzheimer’s, however I believe those studies have been mostly inconclusive, last time I looked into it.
The bigger issue is that you risk getting chunks of the Teflon coating breaking off of the pan and getting into your food. While it’ll pass through you mostly harmlessly, it’s still not ideal. And it’s just gross.
I’d recommend tossing that pan and getting a new one and only using it for low/medium-high temps, as well as picking up a stainless steel pan (assuming you don’t have any metal allergies), and use that for things that need more heat to cook.
Also, be gentler with your pans, in general. It looks like you’ve been sticking a fork or some other metal utensil in there, which is a bad idea. If you’re using a metal spatula or something, stop that; just use plastic/rubber/wood on your non-stick items. If you’re hand-washing it, just use a sponge or a soft brush, but don’t use anything abrasive like steel wool or those sponges with the “hard” side for grease and grime, as those can also rapidly degrade the Teflon coating.
Something you should be aware of: Many, many range hoods, particularly in cheap housing like apartments, do NOT ventilate outside. They move the steam/smoke/etc away from the cooktop, but just blow it back into the kitchen. In some cases, right into the face of whoever is standing in front of the stove.
Huh, I always thought pineapples and tomatoes were canned in non-aluminium tins that also have a coating on the inside to prevent corrosion. Them tins don’t really feel as soft as a beer or soda can.
Someone who tells you Teflon is fine should absolutely not be believed. Doesn’t matter if their wall of text might sound convincing
Except no-one has produced a convincing source showing there’s a problem. I’m quote willing to change my mind, but not on the basis of “because”
There’s a reason why acidic foods like tomatoes and pineapples are canned in aluminum; because it’s safe to do so.
No, it’s because the inside of the cans are coated with plastic (which contained BPA until recently, but that’s a whole 'nother issue…).
OP, please don’t trust this one’s comments. See following document, sections 6 and 7.
PTFE (teflon) is toxic. As soon as your pan is damaged you should throw it out.
That doesn’t say it’s unsafe to cook with. PFAS, in industrial use, are hella dangerous. But not all PFAS are the same, and Teflon is specifically treated to be food-safe under normal cooking temperatures.
Teflon, sure. But thechemicals and glue used to stick this famously non stic material to a pan, absolutely fucking not.
That isn’t how Teflon is applied to cookware.
So, I think this is is where we ask for some reliable research showing that the way that Teflon is applied to the pan is toxic in cooking use
So I’ve just read that paper and it’s very interesting. The vast bulk of it is about the danger of polymer processing aid used during the manufacturer of teflon and how they could leach during manufacture, use and product disposal.
The manufacture and disposal phases encompass environment pollution - important, but not relevant to safety during cooking.
The in-use section of the paper is largely about concentrations used in cosmetics (who knew?) and the potential affects.
What about cooking? There is one line that I could find in the paper - I may have missed something, of course. It says this:
“Fluoropolymer-coated food contact materials (e.g., metal cookware), if not properly pretreated, could lead to the leaching of nonpolymeric PFAS residuals into food during the use phase.”
So - if not properly pretreated (I don’t think the paper expands on what this means), it could lead to leaching. But the paper has nothing to say about whether this leaching occurs with everyday cookware and if so, if it happens at concentrations that could be harmful.
So I’m going to suggest that this paper does not present any evidence that non-stick pans are harmful to health during cooking.
Thank you for reading the source, the amount of FUD in this thread is crazy.
ATK just did a short video on this. It’s probably not as detailed as you might want but here you go. I believe Teflon is used because it is so innocuous, but the chemicals used underneath to make it stick are very bad for you. https://youtu.be/2RJkIPT-jLs?si=w0X3lpQK9tnaMmbA
